IPB

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

4 Pages V   1 2 3 > »   
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Roman Polanski arrested, Took'em long enough...
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 07:58 PM
Post #1





Guests






http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2009...l-incident.html

Now, maybe it's just me...but I don't feel too sympathetic towards an admitted child rapist/runaway fugitive, no matter how great his movies are.

This post has been edited by overly_critical_man: Sep 28 2009, 07:58 PM
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Research Monkey_*
post Sep 28 2009, 08:33 PM
Post #2





Guests






QUOTE ("Kirk Fogg")
too bad he got arrested for this because committing sexual crimes against children is one of the few things that being a rich famous white holocaust survivor really can't excuse you for


Jokes aside, I'm with OCM. It's about time he paid his debt to society.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 08:48 PM
Post #3





Guests






I wonder how long it's going to take before we get a Kanye or Chris Hansen photoshop out of this.

Roman: Oh man, another lifetime achievement award!

*Flies to Switzerland*

Chris Hanson: Mr. Polanski, please take a seat over there...
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 09:49 PM
Post #4





Guests






I feel sorry for his victim, because every time Polanski does something, I'm sure the media swarms her asking for her opinion on it. I'm not shocked she just wants to forget the whole thing.

Thing is, they already had the trial and Polanski was already convicted of the crime. He made a run for it when he was about to be sentenced.

So, even if he's already made whatever monetary settlements with the woman he raped, there's still a debt to society that needs to be paid. Or at the very least, he's gotta face the music. He might get the charges thrown out because of previous misconduct...he might get 50 years in a cell. Either way, he's thumbed his nose at the law for 30 years.

I think that's what a lot of people are pissed off about. He ran off to live in Europe and didn't face up to the consequences of his own crime. If anything, people hate cowards(and pederasts).
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Widget!_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:39 PM
Post #5





Guests






QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 03:34 PM) *
we put people in prison (or we should) to rehabilitate them or because they're a threat to society, not to satisfy our own need to see people who violate social norms suffer.


Debator, it occurs to me that this has to be the single most retardedly idealistic sentence I think you've ever put into print.

If we were interested in rehabilitating people who've committed crimes, drug laws wouldn't be half as harsh, and behavioral-rehabilitation programs would exist within prison that don't amount to opened libraries and exercise courts. If we were interested in shelving away threats to society, death penalties would be followed in all states, and the covered crimes would be far more extensive.

No, we have prisons because they act as a hole in which those who break the societal norms can rot away their days doing nothing, and when and if they should ever get out, they can know that their very existence has been handicapped against them by various "punishments" society enforces.

The prison is not--and has never been--a tool for rehabilitation or for protecting society. It's another way to torture those who break the "rules".
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:42 PM
Post #6





Guests






QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 03:35 PM) *
what the hell is a "debt to society"? that sounds like a politically correct term for an unsatisfied desire for revenge. we put people in prison (or we should) to rehabilitate them or because they're a threat to society, not to satisfy our own need to see people who violate social norms suffer. is polanski a threat to society? i don't know. he certainly raped a little girl. should he go to prison for it, 30 years after the fact? who's to say. (hint: the legal system.)

watching chinatown right now. good movie.


I was trying to draw a line between civil and criminal justice.

Anyhow, he was already convicted. They can give him time served or whatever, but fleeing the country was certainly not cool.

This post has been edited by overly_critical_man: Sep 28 2009, 10:44 PM
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Captaink_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:46 PM
Post #7





Guests






QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 05:35 PM) *
what the hell is a "debt to society"? that sounds like a politically correct term for an unsatisfied desire for revenge. we put people in prison (or we should) to rehabilitate them or because they're a threat to society, not to satisfy our own need to see people who violate social norms suffer. is polanski a threat to society? i don't know. he certainly raped a little girl. should he go to prison for it, 30 years after the fact? who's to say. (hint: the legal system.)

watching chinatown right now. good movie.

If roman polanski wasn't roman polanski, would it even be an issue? If some random guy raped a 13 year old, was convicted, and skipped town before the sentencing, there would be no question that he should "pay" for his crime. So what if he made a bunch of critically-acclaimed movies? Laws must be enforced uniformly or they lose their effectiveness.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:47 PM
Post #8





Guests






And speaking of Chinatown...he raped her inside Jack Nicholson's house while he was away on vacation. Also not cool.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Mr. Tree_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:55 PM
Post #9





Guests






Man, he's been around for freakin' ever. I associate him more with the Manson murders in his house (or was it just Tate?), and that was way back in the day.

So why does Switzerland give a smurf? If America asked I'd be like "no fanks, we're fine". That's what they usually do.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:57 PM
Post #10





Guests






QUOTE (Mr. Tree @ Sep 28 2009, 03:55 PM) *
Man, he's been around for freakin' ever. I associate him more with the Manson murders in his house (or was it just Tate?), and that was way back in the day.

So why does Switzerland give a smurf? If America asked I'd be like "no fanks, we're fine". That's what they usually do.


Apparently the US and the Swiss have some sort of treaty for extraditing criminals back to the US.

And it's pretty funny how France and Poland want the Swiss to grant him bail. He's not a threat to flee or anything, amirite?

This post has been edited by overly_critical_man: Sep 28 2009, 10:59 PM
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Mr. Tree_*
post Sep 28 2009, 10:59 PM
Post #11





Guests






WAIT WAIT WAIT The Swiss actually have international relations?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 11:00 PM
Post #12





Guests






QUOTE (Mr. Tree @ Sep 28 2009, 03:59 PM) *
WAIT WAIT WAIT The Swiss actually have international relations?


They're neutral...not isolationist, Stan.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Research Monkey_*
post Sep 28 2009, 11:16 PM
Post #13





Guests






QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Sep 28 2009, 02:49 PM) *
I feel sorry for his victim, because every time Polanski does something, I'm sure the media swarms her asking for her opinion on it. I'm not shocked she just wants to forget the whole thing.


She does, and has said so pretty explicitly.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Sep 28 2009, 11:20 PM
Post #14





Guests






QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 04:14 PM) *
our extradition treaty with switzerland hasn't obliged them to do anything about it while he's maintained one of his residences there over the last 30 years. the US only furnished an international warrant for arrest in 05.


He's also been able to avoid capture a few times, because he knew in advance they were going to try to detain him once he got there.

This time, the awards show advertised his appearance.

It only took 30 years to lull him into a false sense of security.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Research Monkey_*
post Sep 28 2009, 11:46 PM
Post #15





Guests






QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 03:35 PM) *
what the hell is a "debt to society"? that sounds like a politically correct term for an unsatisfied desire for revenge.


It's a politically correct term for saying "it must be shown to society that even if you're a rich, famous holocaust survivor, no still means no."

Revenge? No. His life has been thoroughly smurfed as is, I don't think he needs anything worse. But where is the equality and the standard of justice if he doesn't ever face the punishment his peers and a judge deemed appropriate?

QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 03:35 PM) *
we put people in prison (or we should) to rehabilitate them or because they're a threat to society, not to satisfy our own need to see people who violate social norms suffer. is polanski a threat to society? i don't know. he certainly raped a little girl. should he go to prison for it, 30 years after the fact? who's to say. (hint: the legal system.)


I have no interest in seeing anyone suffer, and I'm not a vengeful person. However, I certainly see value in the threat of jail time as a deterrent. He poses no threat to American 13 year olds while he is in Switzerland, so in that sense, imprisoning him would serve no purpose to correct his behavior or protect American society from him. However, it poses a very significant threat to society if we set the precedent that "it's okay to bone little kids, as long as you run away to Europe afterward." As Aristotle would say, legislation must direct the masses to virtue, as they will listen to neither argument nor teaching, but only be made to obey out of fear of punishment. Similarly, if there is no direct risk or economic bad to apply negative utility to a given action, there is no reason why a person will not opt to act that way.

To put it another way, why do you lock the door to your house when you leave? A burglar can still get in through the window, or break down the door, or a variety of other methods. The lock is not to keep intruders out, but to keep honest people honest. If there is no obvious deterrent reinforcing social moral standards (in this case that a person has the right to refuse sexual advances by another person, and have their wishes be respected), crimes of opportunity (in this case, the rape of a 13 year old girl) are bound to occur.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Research Monkey_*
post Sep 28 2009, 11:56 PM
Post #16





Guests






QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Sep 28 2009, 03:57 PM) *
QUOTE (Mr. Tree @ Sep 28 2009, 03:55 PM) *
Man, he's been around for freakin' ever. I associate him more with the Manson murders in his house (or was it just Tate?), and that was way back in the day.

So why does Switzerland give a smurf? If America asked I'd be like "no fanks, we're fine". That's what they usually do.


Apparently the US and the Swiss have some sort of treaty for extraditing criminals back to the US.

And it's pretty funny how France and Poland want the Swiss to grant him bail. He's not a threat to flee or anything, amirite?


I'm fairly certain we have one with almost all countries (save China, North Korean, some places in Africa, and countries we don't recognize), just with varying degrees of cooperation. France, for example, can say that it can decline to extradite French citizens, and the Irish have a similar agreement. In fact, there was recently a case involving a Catholic priest who was accused of multiple counts of statutory rape in the US, and the Irish government refused to extradite him because the death penalty was legal in the state in which he was accused.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Research Monkey_*
post Sep 29 2009, 12:26 AM
Post #17





Guests






QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 05:06 PM) *
1. justice is revenge.


Justice is fairness, equality, and ethics.

QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 05:06 PM) *
2. i'm really skeptical of the power of prison as a deterrent to crime. obviously, it works a lot of the time. but violent crime rates are higher in states with the death penalty, so it's not fool-proof (more proof of this fact is that crime exists). and broadly, i think, the reason that people don't go around stealing cars is because they think it's wrong, rather than they think they'll go to jail.


The rates of violent crime are dependent on other factors within the legal system. And I would seriously contest the latter statement.

QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 05:06 PM) *
3. i'm also really against making examples out of people. what, is his punishment to be made a public spectacle? why not throw him in the stockades for a month, or whip out the guillotine in the public square? public punishment to instruct (read: strike fear into) the public feels very french-revolutiony, and is a bad, bad idea.


Me too. Because each are cruel and unusual punishments. I think the United States justice system can be very overzealous at times (I live in a county with Sheriff mothersmurfing Joe) in locking people up for extended periods of time, or even killing them, but even if his "debt to society" is just 500 hours of community service, or some sort of therapy or "rape is bad" class, whatever it is, the point needs to be that the legal system, and the society that it represents, does not accept certain actions.

QUOTE (debator @ Sep 28 2009, 05:06 PM) *
4. i don't lock my door, not in my house. i lock my dorm room, but it has no windows to break. well, it does, but they're six floors above people who could break them. also, i often don't lock my dorm room.


Okay, I hope that works well for you?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_AK_WDB_*
post Sep 29 2009, 01:46 AM
Post #18





Guests






Got to agree with RM on this one. If you rape a 13-year-old girl, you deserve to go to jail, even if you fully intend never to rape a 13-year-old girl again. Call that "revenge" if you want; I call it a reasonable consequence for despicable behavior.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_Mr. Tree_*
post Sep 29 2009, 01:50 AM
Post #19





Guests






Justice is not necessarily revenge. Ya gotta take a look at what they did to you, make sure you were right first of all.

Roman definitely deserves justice, but what America gives him is more likely to be greater than he deserves. If he woulda apologized sincerely by now (he smurfin' should have), then I would have a problem with this. As of now, I haven't heard he has, so to be just in terms of a political society he needs to be put in jail. Especially considering the place statutory rape has in our society.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Guest_AK_WDB_*
post Sep 29 2009, 01:53 AM
Post #20





Guests






QUOTE (Mr. Tree @ Sep 28 2009, 05:50 PM) *
Roman definitely deserves justice, but what America gives him is more likely to be greater than he deserves. If he woulda apologized sincerely by now (he smurfin' should have), then I would have a problem with this. As of now, I haven't heard he has, so to be just in terms of a political society he needs to be put in jail. Especially considering the place statutory rape has in our society.

Are you serious? "Apologizing sincerely" is not an adequate punishment for rape.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

4 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 19th November 2018 - 04:00 PM