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> SQ Relay Rules
Guest_BearMan_*
post Feb 6 2012, 11:57 PM
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I'm curious as to if this has come up in any other region. In Region IV this weekend a team with less than 9 members (they were missing one scholastic member) wanted to have one of their varsities go in the scholastics place. I OK'd this because in the AZAD handbook it says the following:

"If there are fewer than nine members on the team, a team member of the same (or lower) division may be assigned-in advance-a special ID number with which that student may fill-in for the vacant position during the Public Relay only."

However, this caused some confusion among other coaches, as many thought that the person that went twice in the relay had to be a scholastic. So when we double checked this with Anne she said this was not allowed, that the replacement had to be a scholastic. A varsity was not allowed.

Now Anne has obviously been doing this for a lot longer than I have, so I am confident that she made the right call, but I really think we ought to have the rulebook changed, because that wording certainly fooled me. Has this ever happened anywhere else?
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Guest_Widget!_*
post Feb 7 2012, 12:10 AM
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That's weird; Anne has okayed competing up a division for Relay before.
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Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Feb 7 2012, 12:27 AM
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AFAIK, you don't necessarily need 3 people per category in order to do relay. In fact, this is the first time I've ever heard of a team doing this. Is this a common practice during your sq relays?
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Guest_BearMan_*
post Feb 7 2012, 12:29 AM
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QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Feb 6 2012, 05:27 PM) *
AFAIK, you don't necessarily need 3 people per category in order to do relay. In fact, this is the first time I've ever heard of a team doing this. Is this a common practice during your sq relays?


Yes, I believe it's always been done. It's to keep teams with 9 students from having an unfair advantage over teams with only 8 (or 7, or 6, etc) students.
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The Evil Dr. Cal...
post Feb 7 2012, 12:35 AM
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At Nationals, if you don't have a full team, you take a 0 for the round. Note that in CA the SQ is different than in every other state. AZ does it the same way as TX and Nationals.
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Guest_BearMan_*
post Feb 7 2012, 12:35 AM
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QUOTE (The Evil Dr. Calculus @ Feb 6 2012, 05:35 PM) *
At Nationals, if you don't have a full team, you take a 0 for the round. Note that in CA the SQ is different than in every other state. AZ does it the same way as TX and Nationals.


Interesting ^^. So is this only an Arizona thing?
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Guest_Cody_*
post Feb 7 2012, 12:44 AM
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QUOTE (The Evil Dr. Calculus @ Feb 6 2012, 06:35 PM) *
At Nationals, if you don't have a full team, you take a 0 for the round. Note that in CA the SQ is different than in every other state. AZ does it the same way as TX and Nationals.


Is this if you don't have two in each division or all three? As far as I knew, you only technically needed two in each division to compete.
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The Evil Dr. Cal...
post Feb 7 2012, 12:46 AM
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You can compete with only two in each division, but you'll get 0s for the rounds that you're missing someone.
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Guest_AK_WDB_*
post Feb 7 2012, 01:06 AM
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QUOTE (The Evil Dr. Calculus @ Feb 6 2012, 04:46 PM) *
You can compete with only two in each division, but you'll get 0s for the rounds that you're missing someone.

Yes, but of course, this doesn't damage your team score.
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Guest_Widget!_*
post Feb 7 2012, 01:15 AM
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Yeah, but that's kinda smurfy nonetheless. I mean, didn't MVM boot their alternates between Region and State '09, or something like that? I know they didn't go to Nats that year, but if they had, they'd have had to decide between taking more people to Nats or getting shafted in the relay.

I know relay isn't really important, but, it's kinda nice to be able to have someone pull double-duty when you don't have any competing alternates.

This post has been edited by Widget!: Feb 7 2012, 01:15 AM
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Guest_Cody_*
post Feb 7 2012, 01:17 AM
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In Iowa, we have three alternates in addition to the nine team members that are designated as alternates before the competition and are able to compete against the other alternates. In other states, are the bottom three considered the alternate?
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Guest_AK_WDB_*
post Feb 7 2012, 03:30 AM
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QUOTE (Cody @ Feb 6 2012, 04:17 PM) *
In Iowa, we have three alternates in addition to the nine team members that are designated as alternates before the competition and are able to compete against the other alternates. In other states, are the bottom three considered the alternate?

We have the same thing in Alaska (but they aren't "alternates" in any meaningful sense because they have to be pre-registered before state and cannot switch in for regular team members at the last minute, nor can they replace team members at nationals due to USAD rules).
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Guest_kplay6809_*
post Feb 8 2012, 03:39 PM
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QUOTE (Cody @ Feb 6 2012, 07:17 PM) *
In Iowa, we have three alternates in addition to the nine team members that are designated as alternates before the competition and are able to compete against the other alternates. In other states, are the bottom three considered the alternate?


It's my understanding that in WI, a student designated as an "alternate", who is not on the competing nine, is eligible for competition. It is for this reason that our Honors and Scholastic alternates (we only have three Varsities) wrote the Regionals essay. This way, if a member of the nine was removed from competition for some reason, these "alternates" would not already start 1,000 points down. They have to sign the honesty code for our competitions as well.
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Guest_Gear_*
post Feb 8 2012, 04:06 PM
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QUOTE (BearMan @ Feb 6 2012, 06:29 PM) *
QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Feb 6 2012, 05:27 PM) *
AFAIK, you don't necessarily need 3 people per category in order to do relay. In fact, this is the first time I've ever heard of a team doing this. Is this a common practice during your sq relays?


Yes, I believe it's always been done. It's to keep teams with 9 students from having an unfair advantage over teams with only 8 (or 7, or 6, etc) students.

I wouldn't characterize this as an "unfair" advantage. Each team had the opportunity to have 9 members.
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Guest_BearMan_*
post Feb 8 2012, 05:20 PM
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QUOTE (Gear @ Feb 8 2012, 09:06 AM) *
QUOTE (BearMan @ Feb 6 2012, 06:29 PM) *
QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Feb 6 2012, 05:27 PM) *
AFAIK, you don't necessarily need 3 people per category in order to do relay. In fact, this is the first time I've ever heard of a team doing this. Is this a common practice during your sq relays?


Yes, I believe it's always been done. It's to keep teams with 9 students from having an unfair advantage over teams with only 8 (or 7, or 6, etc) students.

I wouldn't characterize this as an "unfair" advantage. Each team had the opportunity to have 9 members.


Perhaps, but I could argue that it would favor large schools who have a vast supply of students over small schools that might struggle to put together 9 students.
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Guest_AK_WDB_*
post Feb 8 2012, 06:18 PM
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QUOTE (BearMan @ Feb 8 2012, 08:20 AM) *
Perhaps, but I could argue that it would favor large schools who have a vast supply of students over small schools that might struggle to put together 9 students.

So does the entire structure of the competition.
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Guest_overly_critical_man_*
post Feb 8 2012, 06:32 PM
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Meh, ECR and Moorpark often fielded teams with 8 people. I don't see the big deal of needing people to fill spots.
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Guest_BearMan_*
post Feb 8 2012, 09:32 PM
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QUOTE (AK_WDB @ Feb 8 2012, 11:18 AM) *
QUOTE (BearMan @ Feb 8 2012, 08:20 AM) *
Perhaps, but I could argue that it would favor large schools who have a vast supply of students over small schools that might struggle to put together 9 students.

So does the entire structure of the competition.


Good point sir, good point tongue.gif
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Guest_Stealer of Souls_*
post Feb 9 2012, 09:41 PM
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QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Feb 8 2012, 10:32 AM) *
Meh, ECR and Moorpark often fielded teams with 8 people. I don't see the big deal of needing people to fill spots.



Edison only has 7 members this year (3 Honors, 2 Scholastics, 2 Varsity). We got 48 on the relay. Honors to Varsity--9,8,10,9,7,5
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Guest_BearMan_*
post Feb 9 2012, 09:43 PM
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QUOTE (Stealer of Souls @ Feb 9 2012, 02:41 PM) *
QUOTE (overly_critical_man @ Feb 8 2012, 10:32 AM) *
Meh, ECR and Moorpark often fielded teams with 8 people. I don't see the big deal of needing people to fill spots.



Edison only has 7 members this year (3 Honors, 2 Scholastics, 2 Varsity). We got 48 on the relay. Honors to Varsity--9,8,10,9,7,5


With CA the 9 players aren't critical. In AZ though all 9 members get counted, even if they don't count to the overall team score. So missing 2 people would be an automatic loss of 10 potential points.
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